Web Hosting

[Bronyaur]

hi,

Has anyone here paid for remote web hosting? I know Bret does, but he is gone for the weekend. I had some questionssssssssssssssssssss

thanks
-G

[daayou]

raises hand.

www.dreamhost.com

[Bronyaur]

that looks like a great solution

however I was looking for a microsoft box so I could use ASP.NET and SQL 2005 :(

But still I have some generic questions. I read that it's better to register a DNS independently, even though it seems easy to get the DNS with the service. Is there any truth to this? I would guess maybe the service "owns" the DNS even if you break contract if you get it through them, but you keep it if you don't?

And if you do register it independently, is there much hassle to getting it directing to your hosted solution?

I got a link to this:
http://www.easycgi.com/

which looks like a good solution but $22 seems like a little higher than some other ones. On the other hand, windows requires licenses so maybe any windows solution will be more expensive.

Advice please.

And you won't persuade me against .NET. One of the whole reasons I want this is to make a .NET web service on top of a sql 05 DB. :P

[daayou]

Well here is the scoop.

1. When you register a domain, you point it to a DNS server. Now you can run your own DNS server (very common) or you can use a third party service. For my project, I use easydns.com - I use virtual hosting with Amazon and these boxes come up and down and never seem to have the same IP. EasyDNS is scriptable to update the (A) records and I set the TTL (Time to Live) to 2 minutes.

2. So you need a SQL 2005 server. Ok, I am not going to try and convince you not to, that is your choice. If you got a shared SQL Server you are going to save a lot of money. If it is dedicated to you, then expect a large fee.

3. ASP.NET - again, your call.

I used to use: http://rackforce.com/ for hosting. You can get a virtual Windows Box from those guys. They are Canadian :)


It really depends what you want to do. Rackforce is into virtualization and you will get your own box per se, shared via virtualization, but not shared with a lot of others.

http://www.planetsmb.com/asp.php?gclid=CLeOzYDrn5ICFQwcawod4jelRg That is from a google search. You will be on a box sharing everything with everyone. If you have VERY light traffic, this may be your best solution.

[Bigshooter]

Greta its time you tried out sql2008... its delicious

[lornfang]

that looks like a great solution

however I was looking for a microsoft box so I could use ASP.NET and SQL 2005 :(



FAIL

[Bronyaur]

FAIL

There is really no question. I write in .NET professionally, so I can pump out an app much faster than in any other platform.

Daayou, so if I understand correctly, the process would be:

(1) Register a Domain name with a provider like Network Solutions

(2) Pay for a DNS server like at easydns.com, and point my DNS to this server

(3) Pay for a web hosting service like www.planetsmb.com (which looks pretty good) and write a dns script that will update the dns server to point to whatever IP I'm on

Or is my order messed up? I've never done this before dangit.

Thanks for the help.

[daayou]

Close.

1. Fuck Network solutions. This pains me, but go with godaddy.com - much cheaper to register a domain. I think dyersucks.com is available.

2. Don't worry about external DNS. I am fairly confident that they will have their own DNS servers.

Seeing that you seem to be a little confused as to how DNS works, here is a semi quick lesson. The main thing to understand is that DNS does one thing. It basically converts name to number. That is it. How it works is kinda interesting.

Let's assume that you register dyersucks.com with godaddy.com. Here is what happens. You give Godaddy their $12. There will be some fields you need to enter for name servers. This info you will get from Planet. They will probably give you at least two addresses. For purposes of illustration: 69.69.69.69

How DNS works after that point. A user types dyersucks.com - the first thing that happens is their local cache is checked to see if they have an ip for dyersucks.com. If they do not, the client then goes to their DNS server. I assume you use jazzsucks as your isp. Now jazzsucks dns is looked at to see if it has dyersucks.com in it's cache. It doesn't. However, jazzsucks isp has a BIG hint for the dns client. It says, hey, I don't know dyersucks.com but I do know the .com dns server. Now the client doesn't even say thank you :( He goes to a .com dns server (aka Root Servers) here it is asked if it knows dyersucks.com. The answer is YES! Why? Because godaddy populated the root server with the info. When you filled out that paperwork you said dyersucks.com=69.69.69.69 You also said that dyersucks.com is authoritative for the domain. It knows everything about the domain. What does that mean?

DNS records move right to left on the name. dyersucks.com the top level is the .com, the 2nd level is dyersucks. If you had modloves.gretablows.dyersucks.com, you have 3 and 4 levels deep into a domain name. The Root server ONLY knows dyersucks.com it does not know modloves.gretablows.dyersucks.com. This is where YOUR dns server comes into play. You have to set it up to support www.dyersucks.com, modloves.gretablows.dyersucks.com. When a person types in modloves.gretablows.dyersucks.com, it will go to that root server, go to 69.69.69.69. The client will ask THAT dns server if it knows the NUMBER to modloves.gretablows.dyersucks.com That is why it is important to have your OWN dns settings.

Now that I hopefully didn't confuse you toooooooo much, 99.99% of all ISPs let you setup your own DNS. This is how you get 3rd and lower level settings. Now you use DNS to setup up www.dyersucks.com and then you get to learn about email :) DNS has different types of records. There are (A) records, (PTR) records, and (MX) records (this is very simplified)

Here is what some of it looks like.

dyersucks.com A 69.69.69.69 //this is an absolute pointing
www.dyersucks.com PTR dyersucks.com //this points to dyersucks.com
dyersucks.com MX 10 dyersucks.com // mail uses numbers to denote priority
mail.dyersucks.com MX 20 dyersucks.com // this lets you set up mail for mail.dyersucks.com

So what does the above do?

If a user types in www.dyersucks.com, we are gonna go down that tree again. They will go to the root server, then go to YOUR dns server, then get the answer of 69.69.69.69

If a users email program has the outgoing/ingoing setup for dyersucks.com, it will go through the tree again (root, then YOUR DNS)

Ok, so that was longer than I thought.

Now that you get a hosting account, there are a few other things you need to look at.

1. FTP - Seeing that it is a windows box, I do not know if they use SFTP or just plain FTP. There is a program called WinSCP - download it! The difference is FTP is NOT encrypted, SFTP is encrypted.

2. Shell access - Why you would want, I dunno. They may not offer shell access to the box and probably for a VERY good reason. You do not need it.

Ok, I just hunted around their support site. They use PLESK as a control panel. This is SOOOOOOOO easy for you. If you do NOTHING it will setup DNS autoMAGICALLY you for you, with mail records and www records.

Plesk will also let you set up email accounts with ease.

You will NOT get any access to the command prompt. Everything will be done via the Plesk control panel. I am a big fan of Plesk. I was their 30th customer ever :)

Have fun - if you need me, I will be around. Just send me a PM here and I will log onto vent or IM for you.

dave

[Bronyaur]

that was a good lesson! Although I actually do know how DNS works, but I was confused cause (I thought) you said you had easydns as a separate dns server. So you're saying planet will have their own DNS server (static IP, or maybe 2) that I point godaddy to, and their DNS server will automatically route to the correct IP where my website is? That makes sense.

FTP is no problem. I've even written my own FTP/SFTP client :P
Although I also like WinSCP in fact.

[daayou]

For me, I use easydns because of how my servers are.

I use Amazon' EC2 servers. These are dynamic virtual servers. I can turn up one or 1000 in 6 minutes. What happens is that their IP addresses are never the same. So I need to pubish the IPs for round robin DNS. That is why I use easydns, I send the info to easydns's servers on bootup of my servers.

Now as far as planet, you will more thane likely get 1 IP. It will probably be a SHARED IP. Do not oworry too much about it. The HTTP header will hit the IP and pass the site info.

[Bronyaur]

well I got everything set up except I can't figure out how to get Plesk to set up an application in a virtual directory.
I know exactly how to do it in IIS, so it's kind of frustrating. Like if I could do this in IIS it would have been done in half a minute, but after half an hour I still am stuck.
The virtual directory doesn't seem to be working either, but I can tell it is configured as a "Web Directory" at least.

[Bonzo]

I love how I can just stroll into any random thread and find my good name being dragged through the mud!

[Bronyaur]

k i copied one of their premade virtual directories exactly, and it still doesn't work.

I am frustrated :(

[daayou]

http://download1.parallels.com/Plesk/Plesk8.3/Doc/en-US/plesk-8.3-win-clients-guide.pdf

Dyer - it's because your UBER Skilz are apparent everywhere!

[Bret]

linuxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

[Bronyaur]

thanks daayou

I finally figured it out after trial and error and looking on their forums. Apparently you have to create the virtual directories with a very particular physical directory for this solution. Go figure! Makes a little sense I guess, but I'm used to having quite a bit of freedom. :)

I have an application working now. I just need to figure out how to set up ASP membership on the remote database.

Thanks for the advice. I've always wanted to mess around with one of these and I finally get to have fun with it.

[Bronyaur]

linuxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

yeah right. If I'm having this much trouble with something I know like the back of my hand on a local machine, I would cringe at trying something else.

Plus I know .NET really well, and I don't know php at all (though this solution can host php apps! in fact it has an option to install phpBB messageboards automatically)

[daayou]

Glad it is working out for you.

Just a quick pointer.

Shared servers = RIGID controls.
Dedicated servers = do what you want.

[lornfang]

yeah right. If I'm having this much trouble with something I know like the back of my hand on a local machine, I would cringe at trying something else.

Plus I know .NET really well, and I don't know php at all (though this solution can host php apps! in fact it has an option to install phpBB messageboards automatically)

You never learn if you don't try... plus there's like 3 or 4 of us on here that know linux like the backs of our hands.

[daayou]

Linux is not the issue doofus :) It is his programming language. Why people are insistent on putting square pegs in round holes I will never know.

[Bronyaur]

Glad it is working out for you.

Just a quick pointer.

Shared servers = RIGID controls.
Dedicated servers = do what you want.

Yeah but dedicated servers are too expensive for what I want to do lol

@Lorn: This isn't an adventure though. I have an web app I want to write. I've already designed it in .NET with a asmx web service behind it. I know how to implement it and deploy it in .NET. I want to push it out quickly. What I needed was a server to push it out to. :P

If I was just doing this for the sake of doing it I might have done PHP. In fact once this project is done I will probably experiment with php so I can help Bret write stuff for this site. The nice thing about this solution is, like I said, it can host .NET and php apps. But yes I've never set up a php app so I might need some help there when the time comes.

[daayou]

Greta -

http://codeigniter.com/

[lornfang]

.net is evil. That is all.